tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9199848742267562587.post533242322317727301..comments2024-02-06T10:31:24.491-07:00Comments on Watching the World Wake Up: Meep! Meep! Everything I Knew About Roadrunners I Learned From the CartoonWatcherhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02248341788957416471noreply@blogger.comBlogger13125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9199848742267562587.post-42005451227958352582009-12-03T06:49:32.284-07:002009-12-03T06:49:32.284-07:00I said "early fossil record" - the examp...I said "early fossil record" - the examples you found are all Neogene. The moa and emu examples well postdate the divergence of the modern groups (the dromornithids which appear in the same paper as the emu are no longer regarded as ratites - more like giant flightless ducks). The egg taxon I wouldn't know enough to comment on.<br /><br />There are a few older potential fossil ratites out there (e.g. <i>Eleutherornis</i>, <i>Remiornis</i>) but unfortunately we just lack the knowledge to feel confident about how they fit in. Alternatively, some authors have supported origins of particular subgroups of ratites from fossil flying birds such as lithornithids and <i>Palaeotis</i>, but again there is little agreement.Christopher Taylorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11075565866351612441noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9199848742267562587.post-21644341769014103032009-12-02T21:08:02.168-07:002009-12-02T21:08:02.168-07:00Nevermind, graphic loaded on refresh.Nevermind, graphic loaded on refresh.Enelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00967981896718833776noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9199848742267562587.post-57982159822880450672009-12-02T21:07:07.487-07:002009-12-02T21:07:07.487-07:00Roadrunners are cool. Period. Always worth a sto...Roadrunners are cool. Period. Always worth a stop, look and gander. They are fierce hunters that remind me of the raptors in Jurassic Park. Interestingly, Robins also stimulate this thought.<br /><br />We have them and we are not hot desert although we are near the Sonoran, at 5k feet, it is a different zone.<br /><br />One of your graphics (the one with the swift) did not load for me, but I could click the link.Enelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00967981896718833776noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9199848742267562587.post-54745545036063778742009-12-02T19:51:11.048-07:002009-12-02T19:51:11.048-07:00Christopher- great input, thanks! Couple comments ...Christopher- great input, thanks! Couple comments in return, (following your enumeration):<br /><br />A)Following up, my ratite evolution summary looks to be a year and a half out of date. The old story (which I believe I initially picked up from one of David Quammen's books in the mid-90's) was a monophyletic group with a flightless common ancestor. The <a href="http://www.pnas.org/content/105/36/13462" rel="nofollow">new story</a> (as of 2008) is that they’re probably paraphyletic, unless grouped together with tinamous, which do fly (if not particularly well), and now it looks as though ratites lost flight capability at least 3 times independently.<br /><br />(I have to wonder though, is it fair to call the ratite fossil record “non-existent”? A quick search pulled up pretty specific examples of ratite fossils <a href="http://www.samuseum.sa.gov.au/Journals/RSAM/RSAM_v014/rsam_v014_p413p420.pdf" rel="nofollow">here</a>, <a href="http://palaeo-electronica.org/2006_1/eggshell/eggs.pdf" rel="nofollow">here</a> and <a href="http://www.terranature.org/moa.htm" rel="nofollow">here</a>…)<br /><br />B)I think your example- birds & bats- is a bit of a case of apples & oranges. In birds the upstroke of the “flap” is powered by the supracoracoideus muscle, which is attached to the sternum along the base of the keel, underneath and surrounded by the pectoralis muscle, which is attached to the (same) keel above and around it. Hence the need for the large keel. (Nice little diagram <a href="http://media-2.web.britannica.com/eb-media/50/51950-004-002B41AA.gif" rel="nofollow">here</a>.) In bats, the upstroke is powered by the deltoids, which are anchored on the back side, (and so don't need to be packed under the pectoralis and anchored to the same spot) and so they do fine without an expanded keel. For an ostrich to regain flight without (re-?) expanding the keel, the musculature would have to be pretty dramatically re-routed. Maybe there are good examples of keel-less flying birds I'm not aware of, but bats aren't it.<br /><br />C)Quite right. I should have qualified “predators” with “mammalian.” Thanks for piping up.Watcherhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02248341788957416471noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9199848742267562587.post-89730068492889936372009-12-02T16:31:53.261-07:002009-12-02T16:31:53.261-07:00(A) No, we don't know from fossil evidence tha...(A) No, we don't know from fossil evidence that ratites became flightless before dispersing to their current distributions. The early fossil record for ratites borders on the non-existent.<br /><br />(B) Bats also lack a large keel on the sternum. They fly just fine.<br /><br />(C) New Zealand was far from predator-free; in fact, New Zealand birds were exposed to some pretty terrifying predators (the world's largest eagle, for starters). The thing is, though, all the major New Zealand predators were other birds, and flying isn't so hot as an escape mechanism when what you're escaping from can fly as well (similarly, while ground-nesting is a disaster when mammalian predators are about, it's quite effective when it comes to hiding nests from aerial predators).Christopher Taylorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11075565866351612441noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9199848742267562587.post-61155932114143588902009-12-02T16:18:12.130-07:002009-12-02T16:18:12.130-07:00It occurs to me that evolutionary in-betweens are ...It occurs to me that evolutionary in-betweens are more a human perception than anything. We like neat and tidy, but nature isn't so picky - as long as the organism stays alive and reproduces it's successful.<br /><br />These in-betweeners also offend our sensibilities. If I knew my great-great-great-great-grandfather could fly, but since then the family line lost that ability, I'd be crushed. But the Roadrunner is OK with mostly running and only occasionally flying - it is what it is. We're such an egotistical species; always anthropomorphizing.KanyonKrishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01954169751206336705noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9199848742267562587.post-48807616619174678322009-12-02T15:22:04.883-07:002009-12-02T15:22:04.883-07:00cmsparks- You know, I think deep down that's e...cmsparks- You know, I think deep down that's everyone's secret fantasy- that someday their perfect box will come from Acme. Nice way to phrase it.<br /><br />Jube- Hey maybe <i>I'll</i> come up with a breakfast cereal. It'd be little <a href="http://lh6.ggpht.com/_6LWjP0sZ22w/SvzoBAONiLI/AAAAAAAAGwM/vrp5ODLWiCk/s1600-h/wwwlogo3%5B5%5D.jpg" rel="nofollow">WTWWU logos</a>, but it would taste like Quisp. Or maybe peanutbutter Cap'n Crunch. And the commericals would have happy-looking people tucking into bowls of WTWWU-O's as the sun breaks over the horizon, with a narrator saying, "Watch the World Wake up the <i>right</i> way..."<br /><br />I might need to leave the eye out of the logo-cereal pieces though; that might creep people out.Watcherhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02248341788957416471noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9199848742267562587.post-6503893743480862662009-12-02T15:09:19.053-07:002009-12-02T15:09:19.053-07:00Kris- thanks for the typo catch- fixed it.
And ye...Kris- thanks for the typo catch- fixed it.<br /><br />And yes, new banner. Actually I put that banner up last week, then added the bling last night. The diagram in the thought-cloud is the <a href="http://lh5.ggpht.com/_6LWjP0sZ22w/SfrghlKw5XI/AAAAAAAAEVM/0MfeVVn6A_8/s1600-h/SCurve4.jpg" rel="nofollow">S-curves/ Counter-steering graphic</a> from the post I did after our 1-day <a href="http://watchingtheworldwakeup.blogspot.com/2009/05/desert-wildflowers-s-curves-and.html" rel="nofollow">Hurricane trip </a> last Spring.<br /><br />I like to change the banner every month or so, but yours is pretty cool.Watcherhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02248341788957416471noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9199848742267562587.post-34768693355666513752009-12-02T14:47:58.496-07:002009-12-02T14:47:58.496-07:00Also, I like the new banner image. It is new, righ...Also, I like the new banner image. It is new, right? (Knowing me it's probably been up for weeks and I'm just now noticing.)<br /><br />The sight line, the "going fast" streaks, the secret Watcher society symbol, and I assume that's a map you're thinking about.<br /><br />I haven't changed the banner for my blog in ages, maybe it's time.KanyonKrishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01954169751206336705noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9199848742267562587.post-13764279659667265712009-12-02T13:04:22.195-07:002009-12-02T13:04:22.195-07:00Quarry! Mmm, gotta get me some o' that. I can...Quarry! Mmm, gotta get me some o' that. I can then stop taking my mineral supplements, too.Lucyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10896006691904225007noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9199848742267562587.post-76471896161384119052009-12-02T10:54:00.856-07:002009-12-02T10:54:00.856-07:00Roadrunners are cool, even without Looney Toons. I...Roadrunners are cool, even without Looney Toons. I've seen them a few times and was fascinated as I watched them move. And thanks to this post I know know more about them.<br /><br />OK, I know this was just a typo, but it amused me anyway: "... and seems to be an effective foot-form for grasping trucks".<br /><br />Jube, if you like Quake you may also like Quarry:<br /><br />http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j5kE0MY4nYsKanyonKrishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01954169751206336705noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9199848742267562587.post-33194493399465195232009-12-02T09:28:47.720-07:002009-12-02T09:28:47.720-07:00Cool action graphics. Don't feel bad about th...Cool action graphics. Don't feel bad about the seal and otter - there were probably in-betweeners that looked just like them.<br /><br />I must be too young to have eaten Quake cereal, but I loved Quisp. Doing further research, I discovered Quake cereal pieces were shaped like small gears with holes in the center, and that Quake was described in commercials as "bustin' with earthquake power." The cartoon even wore a mining hard hat! Quake is undoubtedly the closest thing to a geology-cereal as there will ever be. I'm going to start a movement to bring it back!Lucyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10896006691904225007noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9199848742267562587.post-4584393434528209032009-12-02T08:28:18.037-07:002009-12-02T08:28:18.037-07:00Watcher,
I am now a little bummed that all my noti...Watcher,<br />I am now a little bummed that all my notions about roadrunners based on the cartoon have been debunked. But I'm OK with that because I learned some really cool new factoids. Next thing you'll tell us is that the Flintstones could not stop their cars with their feet.<br /><br />Yes, I also wished that someday the perfect box would come from Acme, Inc. that would allow the coyote to catch the roadrunner, but deep down knew that it never would really happen (just like Sylvester would never actually get to eat Tweety).Chrishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02009065746928648051noreply@blogger.com